[ExI] Update on the Hawaiian observatory shutdown

Adrian Tymes atymes at gmail.com
Fri Aug 23 02:42:38 UTC 2019

On Thu, Aug 22, 2019 at 7:19 PM Stuart LaForge via extropy-chat <
extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:

> Quoting Adrian Tymes:
> > Especially if, as seems to be the case, they are in fact lying about
> > their ancestral claims.
> How do you figure that? Every article I have read on the matter talks
> about their ancestral claim as a given.

To quote John:
> The difference is there is not a scrap of evidence native Hawaiians ever
lived on top of Mauna Kea, in fact there is no evidence any human being
ever stood on top of it before 1823 when a American missionary climbed it.
And the law is on the astronomers side, they won the 4 year legal battle

> Also it's not really about the
> mountain. It's about native-Hawaiian sovereignty. They want something
> like what all other native-american tribes have. Tribal lands,
> self-policing jurisdiction, and such. And if history is any guide, I
> really can't think of a good reason not to give it to them. I say give
> them the mountain and lease it back from them.

Do you think they would be satisfied with "tribal lands" consisting of a
previously-unused mountain, and that they would not simply use the same
tactic to try to claim more land?  Or that they would be able to police the
mountain effectively?

Better to give them some of the islands no one yet lives on - perhaps Nihoa
and Necker, where there is proof of ancestral claims and self-policing may
be within their means.
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