[ExI] ccp struggles

Tue Apr 14 16:52:52 UTC 2020

I'd also expect most libertarian leaning types to be prepared to defend
their family and homestead without waiting for police to arrive when it
will be too late.

I suspect that that's true of left libertarians like myself, as well as the
right wing ones.  I am not sure that politics has anything to do with home
protection.

bill w

On Tue, Apr 14, 2020 at 11:36 AM Dylan Distasio via extropy-chat <
extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:

> +1 on all of Spike's points.  The disconnect with gun owners and general
> contempt for a key part of the Constitution by John is somewhat
> surprising.  The only rights you are guaranteed are secured by the end of a
> gun barrel.
>
> I'd also expect most libertarian leaning types to be prepared to defend
> their family and homestead without waiting for police to arrive when it
> will be too late.
>
> On Tue, Apr 14, 2020 at 12:23 PM spike jones via extropy-chat <
> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* extropy-chat <extropy-chat-bounces at lists.extropy.org> *On Behalf
>> Of *John Clark via extropy-chat
>> *Sent:* Tuesday, April 14, 2020 8:06 AM
>> *To:* ExI chat list <extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org>
>> *Cc:* John Clark <johnkclark at gmail.com>
>> *Subject:* Re: [ExI] ccp struggles
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Apr 14, 2020 at 9:44 AM spike jones via extropy-chat <
>> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> *> **John, starting out a post with the comment “…Regardless of what the
>> Constitution says…” is not a good way to develop credibility. *
>>
>>
>>
>> Why the hell not?!
>>
>>
>>
>> Because the Constitution is the law of our land.  When you repudiate the
>> ConUS, you repudiate our legal system, which is why we need a militia.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *> **Have you visited a gun shop and made some kind of survey in which
>> you inquired regarding the customers’ gender and age?*
>>
>>
>>
>> >…No I have not…
>>
>>
>>
>> You should, John.  It is educational.  Visit the local firing range too.
>> Talk and listen there.
>>
>>
>>
>> *> **The framers had just survived a bitter struggle against tyranny
>> with only muzzle-loading flintlocks. *
>>
>>
>>
>> >…Then why does Joe Redneck need anything more…
>>
>>
>>
>> For protection against those who treat the militia with disrespect and
>> contempt.
>>
>>
>>
>> Note the second amendment doesn’t say what arms are necessary, only that
>> a militia is necessary to the security of a free state.  I live in a free
>> state.  I agree with the constitution.  John do you agree with the
>> constitution?  If not, I agree with it enough for the both of us, with
>> change left over.
>>
>>
>>
>> >… And you didn't answer my question, are there any limits or does the
>> second amendment allow Walmart to sell H-Bombs?
>>
>>
>>
>> I don’t know that this has come to the Supreme Court, but I can imagine
>> they would say it is the states’ call.  As far as I know, Walmart has never
>> had H-Bomb in its catalog.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> >…And you didn't answer my other question either, if the crackpot
>> militias and a modern professional army are really on the same side then
>> why on earth do we need the redneck's shotgun?
>>
>>
>>
>> We don’t need the redneck’s shotgun.  If you wish to take up with the
>> neck of color why she needs her shotgun, then do go right ahead.  Good
>> chance she will tell you it is to hunt ducks and protect her from people
>> like you.  Fortunately we don’t need to know why we need the neck of
>> color’s shotgun.
>>
>>
>>
>> By the way John, how much free speech do you need?  Do you need high
>> capacity free speech?  Or can the government put a legal limit on your
>> words, and the type of words you use?  I like my free speech and I do not
>> wish for government people telling me how many words and which words I can
>> use.
>>
>>
>>
>> >…The only well regulated militias in the US are the National Guard, the
>> Navy Militia, and 23 state militias…
>>
>>
>>
>> You left out the unorganized militia, which is none of the above.  You
>> were part of the unorganized militia for 28 years:
>>
>>
>>
>> 10 U.S. Code § 246.Militia: composition and classes
>>
>> ·         U.S. Code
>> <https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/10/246#tab_default_1>
>>
>> ·         Notes
>> <https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/10/246#tab_default_2>
>>
>> prev | next <https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/10/247>
>>
>> *(a)*
>>
>> The militia of the United States consists of all able-bodied males at
>> least 17 years of age and, except as provided in section 313 of title 32
>> <https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/32/313>, under 45 years of age
>> who are, or who have made a declaration of intention to become, citizens of
>> the United States and of female citizens of the United States who are
>> members of the National Guard.
>>
>> *(b)*The classes of the militia are—
>>
>> *(1)*
>>
>> the organized militia, which consists of the National Guard and the Naval
>> Militia; and
>>
>> *(2)*
>>
>> the unorganized militia, which consists of the members of the militia who
>> are not members of the National Guard or the Naval Militia.
>>
>>
>>
>> >… Most of the others are crackpots and are not regulated at all, the 2
>> largest are the  Oath Keepers
>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oath_Keepers>  and the Three Percenters
>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_Percenters>, neither one exactly
>> gives me a warm and fuzzy feeling, in fact I'd trust them about as far as I
>> could comfortably spit out a rat…  John K Clark
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> No worries, John, you don’t give them a warm and fuzzy feeling either,
>> and they don’t trust you as far as they could spit a rat.  They exist to
>> protect you and to protect themselves if you attack them.  However, they
>> are peaceful types.  None of the murders in the worst hotspots are carried
>> out by these organizations.  If they were the problem, we would know.
>>
>>
>>
>> spike
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