[ExI] Mental Phenomena

Brent Allsop brent.allsop at gmail.com
Tue Feb 4 15:52:55 UTC 2020

Hi John:

Evidently, you’re not fully grasping what is going on if you think what you
are saying is true.  Once we discover which physics it is in our brain
which has a redness quality, we will have a dictionary connecting the word
“redness” to that physical quality.  (example being glutamate behavior is
redness behavior.)

“There would be no way you could even notice subjectively that a change of
some sort had been made.”

False.  Subjectively a physical redness quality you are directly aware of
would change from redness to greenness, a huge subjective change.  Because
we have such a dictionary, people will be able to answer questions like:
“What is your redness like?”  with “glutamate” and you will know that is
like your greenness, and so on.

“And there is no way I could see any change in your objective behavior

False, Objectively, you could observe whatever physics it is which that
brain is using to represent conscious knowledge of the red with (example:
glutamate) and when it physically changed (example: changed to glycine) you
would know that that brain is a qualia invert from what it was, before.

And there will be the 3 different forms of effing the ineffable to
objectively verify all this.

What is it that you think: “My redness is like your greenness, both of
which we call red.” Means?

Once we have the dictionary, and better ability to observe the brain, we’ll
be able to ask people questions like: What do you represent red with?
People will know if they are normal, or a red/green qualia invert from
normal people.

And if we see a bat using glutamate to represent echolocation information
with, we’ll be able to answer the question: “What is it like to be a bat?”
with, it is like glutamate, or your redness.

And the best part, all the absurd religious beliefs about qualia, such
as “substance
dualism <https://canonizer.com/topic/88-Substance-Dualism/48>”, “everything
including rocks are conscious
is down at the quantum level <https://canonizer.com/topic/88-Orch-OR/20>”
and all the mistaken people making careers of arguing there is a “hard mind
body problem” of some kind will finally be put out of business.  So many
other absurd ideas people currently believe in will be objectively proven
false.  The only reason people believe in them, today, is because they know
science “can’t account for qualia”.  Once we can account for all this, only
people like “flat earthers” will be able to be justified in believing in
all such absurdity.

On Tue, Feb 4, 2020 at 5:44 AM John Clark via extropy-chat <
extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:

> On Mon, Feb 3, 2020 at 4:17 PM Brent Allsop via extropy-chat <
> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
>> >You [Ben] asked:
>> “Now why on earth would the experience of redness suddenly become the
>> experience of greenness? *How* could it?”
>> By simply inverting the red green signal anywhere in the causal chain of
>> events that is perception as proven can be done here
>> <https://canonizer.com/videos/consciousness/>
> You keep saying that but I don't know what you think has been proven. As
> long as the inversion was done consistently and included memories (so ripe
> strawberries and leaves don't suddenly have the same color) then there
> would be no way you could even notice subjectively that a change of some
> sort had been made. And there is no way I could see any change in your
> objective behavior either. So if whatever you're talking about produces no
> subjective change, and no objective change in behavior, then whatever
> change you're talking about is not important to either.
>  John K Clark
> _______________________________________________
> extropy-chat mailing list
> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org
> http://lists.extropy.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/extropy-chat
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.extropy.org/pipermail/extropy-chat/attachments/20200204/9f840f46/attachment.htm>

More information about the extropy-chat mailing list