[ExI] the CDC's weird recommendation on masks

Thu Mar 12 01:19:13 UTC 2020

The elbow bump is new to me.  Of course it takes a few decades for things
to get from NYC to Mississippi.  Coughing into elbow is very rare.  bill w

On Wed, Mar 11, 2020 at 5:43 PM Dylan Distasio via extropy-chat <
extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:

> I'm surprised to hear that.  I would expect everyone to follow that these
> days.   The good thing is that all of the kids, at least in my area, have
> it ingrained from home/school to cough into their elbows prior to this
> mess.   You may want to make them aware of the elbow bump which is now de
> riguer to replace the handshake :-).
>
> On Wed, Mar 11, 2020 at 6:26 PM William Flynn Wallace via extropy-chat <
> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
>
>> I have been on a mission to get people to cough into their elbows.  When
>> I tell them this (also saying it's what a nurse told me) they look at me
>> very strangely. But I have been my librarian cough into her hand, put it on
>> a book and hand it to me. Why has it taken so long to get the message
>> across about vectors?   bill w
>>
>> On Wed, Mar 11, 2020 at 4:21 PM Henrik Ohrstrom via extropy-chat <
>> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
>>
>>> Masks do not provide a good protection, likely because direct inhalation
>>> or depositing of viri that the mask can protect against is not the main
>>> problem when you get infected (most of the time/viruses) instead it is
>>> depositing infectious stuff on surfaces ie cough in hand, take handle and
>>> the next person takes handle, get virus particles on hand and proceeds to
>>> touch face, eyes nose mouth and insert virus into system that way. this
>>> means take really gross gloves protect better against influenza and likely
>>> covid.
>>> So we should all stockpile nasty gloves.....
>>> /henrik
>>>
>>> Den ons 11 mars 2020 kl 20:56 skrev Dylan Distasio via extropy-chat <
>>> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org>:
>>>
>>>> I suspect another reason is that there are no longer any masks
>>>> available in most US locations, and the government does not have a
>>>> stockpile that is in sufficient quantities.
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Mar 11, 2020 at 3:47 PM Dan TheBookMan via extropy-chat <
>>>> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> It might give people a false sense of security... That said, my mask
>>>>> is a P200, but I got it for fire season years ago.
>>>>>
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>
>>>>> Dan
>>>>>    Sample my Kindle books at:
>>>>>
>>>>> http://author.to/DanUst
>>>>>
>>>>> On Mar 11, 2020, at 12:04 PM, Stuart LaForge via extropy-chat <
>>>>> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> 
>>>>> I don't understand this recommendation from the CDC for the public to
>>>>> NOT wear masks for COVID-19 prophylaxis. Is it based on any evidence or
>>>>> data? Or is it just because the supply shortage for healthcare workers?
>>>>> Maybe N-95 respirators are overkill for the general public that is not
>>>>> regularly face to face with infected patients or entering rooms with
>>>>> several patients. But why shouldn't somebody at risk not wear a surgical
>>>>> mask on the subway or bus?
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes, the virus is small enough to go through the pores of a surgical
>>>>> mask but it will certainly stop many of the larger aerosol droplets. From
>>>>> the average cough or sneeze from three to six feet away. In fact according
>>>>> to this review of the literature, simple disposable surgical masks ARE
>>>>> effective in protecting the wearer according to 6 out of 7 studies. This is
>>>>> stronger than the evidence for the efficacy of hand washing which was also
>>>>> protective but in only 4 out 7 studies.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> https://www.cochranelibrary.com/cdsr/doi/10.1002/14651858.CD006207.pub4/full
>>>>>
>>>>> "These data suggest that wearing a surgical mask or a N95 mask is the
>>>>> measure with the most consistent and comprehensive supportive evidence.
>>>>> Seven out of eight studies included masks as a measure in their study and
>>>>> six out of seven of these studies found masks to be statistically
>>>>> significant in multivariable analysis. Handwashing was also included in
>>>>> seven of the studies with four studies showing handwashing to be
>>>>> statistically significant in multivariable analysis. All other measures
>>>>> were shown to be statistically significant in multivariable analysis on
>>>>> only one or two occasions."
>>>>>
>>>>> What is going on here? Does the CDC just think everybody is too stupid
>>>>> to properly use a face mask properly? I have in the past been coughed on in
>>>>> public to my great annoyance so it certainly is a realistic risk. My
>>>>> professional opinion as a microbiologist is that at risk people should
>>>>> absolutely wear a mask in crowded conditions and safety glasses or goggles
>>>>> as well. And if you can't buy any because they are sold out or too
>>>>> expensive due to price gouging, then you should make your own:
>>>>>
>>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cZGU2vWHKC8
>>>>>
>>>>> In my opinion ANY barrier to the aerosol from sick people is better
>>>>> than no barrier. Any insights from the other list members with biomed
>>>>> experience?
>>>>>
>>>>> Stuart LaForge
>>>>>
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