[ExI] My guesses about GPTs consciousness

[Will Steinberg]

As a postscript to this I would say that if you are interested in
consciousness and neuroscience, you should really, really try
psychedelics.  A curious mind that never tries them is falling far short of
the perceptual knowledge you could have access to.

They are serious though and you should do them in a safe, clean, and
pleasant setting--perhaps an old house with incandescent lights, dark wood
floors, lots of throw pillows, with a strong and happy mindset, and
probably an experienced tripper guru.

On Mon, Apr 17, 2023, 2:54 PM Will Steinberg <steinberg.will at gmail.com>
wrote:

> I have experienced things in dreams I have not in real life, like being in
> two places at once.  The flavors were nothing really new though.
>
> One thing I noticed after doing a lot of psychedelics, especially DMT.
> When you smoke it in particular, the ascent of psychedelia is very fast.
> It starts as brighter colors, then becomes extremely high pattern
> recognition (visual part is most obvious) with subjective fractal
> hallucinations pouring off of the objectively present patterns (imagine
> grokking the fluid dynamics of a cloud, plus hallucinating mandelbrots at
> the edges.)
>
> Then, suddenly, the fractals coalesce into figures and scenes overlaid
> with more fractals, and then clear figures and scenes, without the typical
> psychedelia.  Crisp edges.  The patterns become the patterns of a story,
> instead or a shape.
>
> After doing this a lot I also started to notice being in this
> between-geometry-and-story state when I was in hypnagogia.
>
> From this personal experience I think that the geometry is essentially the
> building blocks of more clear perception.  At some point in the trip there
> is so much information that it turns into a story instead of a relatively
> simpler geometric pattern.
>
> On Mon, Apr 17, 2023, 2:48 PM Brent Allsop via extropy-chat <
> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
>
>>
>> Very interesting.
>> Was there any qualities you had never experienced before?  Or was it just
>> flavors made of light qualities, and other remapping of qualities you were
>> already familiar with?
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Apr 17, 2023 at 12:30 PM Will Steinberg via extropy-chat <
>> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
>>
>>> Just strange things like sparkly pastries and layered milkshakes, those
>>> are some I remember.   Used to lucid dream a lot so one time I remember I
>>> tried eating some salsa and I woke myself up and spit it onto my bed in the
>>> hypnagogic state.   At the time I felt I was so close to actually bringing
>>> something back from the dream world, lol
>>>
>>> On Mon, Apr 17, 2023, 2:00 PM Brent Allsop via extropy-chat <
>>> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> I'm jealous.  I've never experienced taste and smell in dreams.
>>>> I want to know what "fanciful' is like so I can know the meaning of
>>>> that term in that context.
>>>> I bet someday we'll know which of all our objective descriptions of
>>>> stuff in the brain, is a description of that kind of subjective 'fanciful'.
>>>> And I'm looking forward to being able to say: "oh THAT is what that
>>>> kind of fanciful taste is like."
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Mon, Apr 17, 2023 at 11:21 AM Will Steinberg via extropy-chat <
>>>> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Wtf I have all my senses in my dreams....
>>>>>
>>>>> When I was a kid I used to try and eat in dreams specifically cuz the
>>>>> food was always so fanciful
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sun, Apr 16, 2023, 5:23 PM Ben Zaiboc via extropy-chat <
>>>>> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 16/04/2023 19:07, bill w wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> One cannot sense without consciousness  Jason
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Oh yes we can - dreams.  Visual, mostly, rarely auditory, never
>>>>>> touch, smell or taste (unless some chat member reports any of those. )
>>>>>>  bill w
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I can definitely report that my dreams sometimes incorporate sound
>>>>>> (playing a musical instrument) and touch (we won't go there). Don't recall
>>>>>> taste or smell, though. Proprioception as well, though, very commonly (as
>>>>>> in, almost always. Many of my dreams are about movement - running, cycling,
>>>>>> skating, flying, as well as less common and physically impossible ways of
>>>>>> moving - and I can feel the motion, not just see it).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The question of whether we are conscious while dreaming is an
>>>>>> interesting one, though. Lucid dreaming - are we really conscious then? And
>>>>>> I sometimes have what I'd call 'semi-lucid' dreams where I can control
>>>>>> events, or at least influence them, but am not as conscious as in a lucid
>>>>>> dream.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ben
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