[ExI] The Problem With Counterfeit People

[William Flynn Wallace]

Could it happen that going private could result in a country-wide system of
four lane highways?  Or nuclear missiles?  Or aircraft carriers?  I can see
private forces useful in very small situations but not in national interest
ones.  bill w

On Sat, May 20, 2023 at 4:10 PM efc--- via extropy-chat <
extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:

>
> On Sat, 20 May 2023, Adrian Tymes via extropy-chat wrote:
>
> > On Sat, May 20, 2023 at 9:37 AM efc--- via extropy-chat <
> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
> >       On Sat, 20 May 2023, William Flynn Wallace via extropy-chat wrote:
> >       > We have at least one member who is opposed to taxes.  I asked
> him how we would pay for police and fire and streets etc.
> >       and never got
> >       > an answer.  What is the answer, you think?  I am a classic
> liberal and libertarian. bill w
> >
> >       I think those are services that can be bought from private
> companies if
> >       you need them. Alternatively, they could be bundled into the
> service
> >       package of insurance companies.
> >
> >
> > It's been tried many times, and it doesn't work.  Turns out, you can buy
> bodyguards that way but not police.  The difference is that
>
> Oh, so _you're_ the authority here? ;) I can for sure tell you about
> neigbourhood cooperation to reduce crime, of the old west, old iceland,
> gated communities, security companies, private investigators and
> countless other situations, times and dates where it was tried and it
> did work.
>
> So you will have to do way better than that to convince me.
>
> > police will - at least, often enough - enforce justice even when it is
> against the immediate interests of those who pay them.  Think
> > of part of the service as keeping the funders honest.
>
> My experience of state run police is extremely shitty. They don't care
> about anything, they don't perform, and the only thing they do in my
> experience is to harass honest citizens, while arresting and punishing a
> symbolic amount of small crooks. So no thank you, I'd rather buy the
> services of a private security company, because in my life, the track
> record of police is just ridiculous.
>
> > Those who think that such anticorruption services are merely nice to
> have, and not absolutely essential to the functioning of any
> > modern nation state, need only look at the Russian armed forces and how
> their invasion of Ukraine has fared.  There are many factors
>
> Oh, but russia is an example of why the state should not exist. Once a
> bad guy hijacks the public sector, all that power causes immense
> destruction. Much better to have the ultimate decentralization of power
> and a profit motive to keep people in check. Capitalism is engineered in
> such a way that the one who helps the most people makes the most profit.
> No other system cooperates so well with human natures.
>
> So yes, ukraine is horrible, and russia to, and guess what's, prime
> example of the state and its corruption and why libertarianism is the
> only way.
>
> > Likewise, private fire protection tends to protect your properties but
> not your neighbors' who aren't paying them - which means your
> > property burns down and there's nothing they can do when your neighbor's
> property burns down, which could have been prevented had
> > they stopped it when it was a small fire on your non-paying neighbor's
> property.  Private streets are a textbook tragedy of the
>
> Contract law and negotiation my friend. Yes, it might not work
> perfectly, but neither does the state. I think the entity of the state
> has a record in killing and deaths caused compared with companies and
> markets.
>
> > commons: private streets don't allow for good commerce, while public
> streets make everyone relatively richer.  Hard as it can be to
>
> This is just a statement and not a proof. I state the opposite and point
> to the fact that I've done plenty of business in private locations and
> it worked out beautifully.
>
> > This isn't theory.  This is hard historical fact.  There is no "the true
> form hasn't been tried yet".  This is what happens when it
> > is tried, every time, enough to show that it is the true form.  It has
> been done to the death of millions.
>
> I disagree. Some times it has worked, and sometimes not. Sadly the
> experiments never ran to conclusion since a maffia with monopoly on
> violence ended it called "the state". But, I'll give you this much, the
> state is a powerful entity and crowds out all competition to the
> detriment of everyone.
>
> Fortunately in modern society, there are cracks in the system where
> people at an indiviual level can escape a lot of ills of the state.
>
> Best regards,
> Daniel
> _______________________________________________
> extropy-chat mailing list
> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org
> http://lists.extropy.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/extropy-chat
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.extropy.org/pipermail/extropy-chat/attachments/20230520/4e1c7374/attachment.htm>