[ExI] not that rare earth (part 2 of at least 2)

[John Clark]

On Sun, Nov 2, 2025 at 9:52 AM <spike at rainier66.com> wrote:



> *>> …If there were such an application we already know magnetic or optical
>> properties  can't be involved, because there is great variation in those
>> properties among the different rare earths. So it must be something in
>> their chemical properties because they are all almost identical in that
>> respect…*
>
>
> *> On the contrary John.  The same properties that make those elements so
> difficult to separate makes them mostly interchangeable for magnetic
> purposes. *
>

*Spike, that is simply untrue. The magnetic (and the optical) properties of
rare earth elements are unrelated to their chemical properties. You
certainly can't learn anything about them by looking at the periodic table
of elements because that is only about chemistry. In fact most of the rare
earth elements don't have any interesting magnetic properties at all, the
most important one that does is Neodymium. Samarium is also good at making
magnets, they are not as strong as the Neodymium ones but if small amounts
of Dysprosium and Praseodymium are  added in very precise amounts they can
withstand more heat. *

*>>a t**rade secret that can be told in one short sentence such as
>> "unrefined rare earths can be economically useful in the X chemical
>> process" tend not to remain secret for very long…*
>
>
>
> *> It isn’t a secret.  Plenty of us have figured it out.  I already knew
> because of a project I was on nearly 30 years ago, where a company was
> using whatzisium(one of the obscure “rare” earths (an element that
> surprises you when you hear its name (because you have been around
> chemistry your adult life but never heard of this one (because it isn’t
> used for anything)))*
>

*?????*


> *> There are magnets that use substitute materials for what any rare earth
> does.*
>

*Yes there are substitutes, if you don't mind that the substitute magnet
produces a far weaker magnetic field, and is far heavier, and thus makes a
far crappier electric motor than the ones China makes by the millions.    *

* > But for Tesla it wouldn’t matter anyway, since EVs don’t use very much
> of it anyway.  They can get all that they need.*
>

*No they cannot.  *

>>…*In 2023 Tesla made a grand announcement they were going to find a way
> to make a great electric motor that didn't use any rare earths, but it's
> almost 2026 and we've heard nothing more about that, certainly nothing has
> been put in production…*
>
>
>
> *> How would you know? *
>

*If Tesla started making millions of cars that contain no rare earth
elements EVERYBODY would know. You think something like that could be kept
secret?! *


* > * *The military has all the REEs they need. **They have enough of it to
> supply their own needs indefinitely. *
>

*No they have not.  *


> *> Of course they thought of that: they aren’t going to depend for
> materials on the country we might be at war with soon. *
>

*Yes they have. *

* > John are you seeing a pattern here? *


*No spike I am NOT. I can honestly say I don't know what you're talking
about.  *


*John K Clark*

>
>
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