[ExI] AI 2040

Sat Jul 18 19:02:44 UTC 2026

On Fri, Jul 17, 2026 at 9:40 AM Brent Allsop <brent.allsop at gmail.com> wrote:

>
> Hi Keith,
>
> Reproduction is just making copies, isn't it?
>

Children are not copies.

> And even if we do, make gazilions of copies only in simulations, there
> needs to be some reproduction in the real world to make more computers to
> run more simulations.
>

Run away copies will swamp any simulation.

And of course, I predict the qualitative and motivational nature of
> qualities (of which consciousness is composed) can't be reproduced in
> abstract simulations of the same (consider the word 'red' verses a redness
> quality), so I see everything happening in reality, not simulations.  But
> then that might be a minority view in this group where "functionalism" is
> the popular consensus.
>

I can't parse this.

Keith

>
> And how would reproduction, in the absence of death ever be a problem?
> Have you ever seen the gazilions of galaxies in the 'deep field' image
> taken by the Hubble
> <https://bigcanvasartprints.com/products/hubble-ultra-deep-field-endless-galaxies-of-space?variant=44083993149484&country=US&currency=USD&utm_medium=product_sync&utm_source=google&utm_content=sag_organic&utm_campaign=sag_organic&gad_source=1&gad_campaignid=23157983237&gbraid=0AAAAAqKBVWOiydS4-Vv-RucvIiiAHsA9N&gclid=CjwKCAjwpefSBhBvEiwAzyEtZ87hKGPRJ-UN0tiginiqBlgEvtMVOmenDh4rc00MXj02qqmrENl3axoCY9IQAvD_BwE>?
> Until we at least fill up the Milky Way galaxy, I don't think we'll ever
> have anything to worry about.  There will never be enough to fill the
> vastness of space, it seems to me.
>
>
> On Thu, Jul 16, 2026 at 9:50 PM Keith Henson <hkeithhenson at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> On Thu, Jul 16, 2026 at 3:53 PM Brent Allsop via extropy-chat <
>> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Hi Keith,
>>> Moving on to a life form superior to humans isn't really going extinct,
>>> is it?
>>>
>>
>> If everyone uploads and the uploads don't reproduce, or (somehow)
>> reproduce inside the simulation, then I think a biologist would consider
>> them biologically extinct even if none die.
>>
>> On the other hand, maybe they do reproduce inside the simulation. Tabby's
>> star and the others like it would indicate they might reproduce because
>> what evidence we have indicates they have spread out and population growth
>> would cause that.
>>
>> Can we even imagine what reproduction inside a simulation would be like?
>> Talk about designer kids. In "The Clinic Seed" I sidestepped that by
>> assuming no reproduction due to no deaths. Reproduction in a no death world
>> would cause an interesting population crisis even in a simulated world.
>>
>> And do we share computation resources with AIs? Do they reproduce as
>> well? The only SF I have seen that even comes close is Charles Stross's
>> _Accelerando_.
>>
>> Keith
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Jul 16, 2026 at 2:44 PM Keith Henson via extropy-chat <
>>> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>> 20 years ago, I wrote a story that made the case that the very best
>>>> aligned AI, coupled with human desires, could cause the race to go extinct.
>>>> Nobody has ever refuted the central idea in that story.
>>>>
>>>> Keith
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Jul 16, 2026 at 11:18 AM spike jones via extropy-chat <
>>>> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> *From:* John Clark <johnkclark at gmail.com>
>>>>> *Sent:* Thursday, 16 July, 2026 10:54 AM
>>>>> *To:* spike at rainier66.com
>>>>> *Cc:* ExI chat list <extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org>
>>>>> *Subject:* Re: [ExI] AI 2040
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, Jul 16, 2026 at 10:29 AM <spike at rainier66.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> *Plan A*
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> *>…This Plan, the one they like the best and the one I hate the most,
>>>>> is to coordinate between the US and China to slow the development of AI…*
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> *The notion that the US and China are the AI players that matter
>>>>> understates Israel. *
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> *>…Good point. 14 Israelis have won Nobel prizes and that is a huge
>>>>> number for such a tiny country.  *
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> *John K Clark*
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> *Ja there is that, but specifically in the area of software
>>>>> development, they are towering giants, never mind brains per capita (is
>>>>> there a Nobel prize for software (there aughta be.))  They figured out how
>>>>> to do some software things that the US couldn’t do, even though we yanks
>>>>> threw a a ton of money at it.  In the end, the Israelis won the contract.
>>>>> Their software tech is now part of their Iron Dome.  We built the rockets,
>>>>> the propulsion system, the vehicle controls hardware, the kill vehicle, the
>>>>> kill vehicle controls software, the mobile carrier, then Israelis wrote the
>>>>> system level control software and the simulator.  *
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> *That’s been over 25 years ago but I remember it like it was
>>>>> yesterday.  Oh that was a truly bad ego buster for yank controls
>>>>> engineers.  They whooped our gentile asses in system-level controls
>>>>> software, beat us in every competition in that category.  I was primarily a
>>>>> hardware guy, but I have friends who were most demoralized.  One left the
>>>>> company and went to live in Israel.  He never wrote to us.*
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> *spike  *
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> extropy-chat mailing list
>>>>> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org
>>>>> http://lists.extropy.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/extropy-chat
>>>>>
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>>
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