[extropy-chat] A Call to Arms in the War of Evolution and an Inquiry about SMI2LE

[Jef Allbright]

Brian Campbell wrote:

> **
>
> I choose here to speak my mind because I am finding it more and more 
> difficult to discuss and advance my theories. I know less than 6 
> people who are interested and advanced enough to really stimulate my 
> mind. Revelations are becoming fewer and further between ever passing 
> day and i grow more and more bored. I know of no better place to find 
> the stimulation i need than here. I seek your knowledge and wisdom. I 
> have read the extropy chat and have been really apprehensive about 
> posting because i fear rejection by those older and more intelligent 
> thinkers whom i respect so much.
>
Brian, I think you'll find the Extropy list is a welcoming - but 
critical - forum for the kind of thinking you describe.

Regarding the possibility of rejection, posting only in plain text will 
help to a degree that may surprising, considering how much we generally 
appreciate all the bells and whistles of technology.

> I seek to absorb all the knowledge i can, process it , and spread it 
> too all that are interested. I seek knowledge in every form I can, 
> from writings of all kinds, experience (my own and anyone else's who 
> chooses to share), and conversations/debates. I take in this 
> information , process it based on my previous info, and use it as much 
> as I can to further my understanding of the nature of everything. I 
> share all I know in hopes of getting feedback on alternate points of 
> view, flaws in my theories, and/or new connections/possibilities. This 
> is the meaning of my life. I tell u this here because it is the most 
> meaningful thing I can see in life and in hopes that someone reading 
> this will be inspired or at the very least that this will get them to 
> thinking. I am what Leary calls an Intelligence Agent, and this is my 
> call to arms.
>
> In my opinion, (as everything i say is, of course. so i wont bother 
> stating this further) the purpose of all things in our known universe 
> is to evolve.
>
I think it may be more accurate to say that systems, not individual 
things, tend to evolve, and do you really consider this to be 
purposeful?  If so, who or what is the agent that follows that purpose?  
On the other hand, I suspect you may have been making a value statement, 
rather than meaning literally that evolution has a purpose.

> Our universe is a system, not unlike an exponentially more large and 
> complex computer than those we have created. It is a self-evolving 
> system based on some fundamental rules. As the system gets more 
> complex, there is much more potential in the system for positivity and 
> negativity (in this case just think of it as simply evolution and 
> de-evolution respectively, as i don't feel this is the time or place 
> to go further into my theories on chaotic positivity and negativity). 
> This increase in positive/negative potential cannot be avoided. It is 
> the reward/cost of evolution.
>
Ascribing negative/positive values to the workings of nature smacks of 
the common but less than rigorous dichotomies of Good versus Evil, or 
Love versus Fear and  usually hints that it might be useful to broaden 
one's views toward the more objective.  You might want to clarify what 
you really mean by unavoidable positive/negative potential of evolving 
systems.

> All things go through the process of the metaphysical trinity 
> (dynamism, stasis, entropy, and back to dynamism). This process 
> ensures that all things grow until they reach a barrier or limit of 
> some kind (current technology or information, for instance). They then 
> break down when a new possibility becomes available (certain old 
> aspects in favor of new "potentially" better aspects, survival of the 
> fittest, if u will) allowing for further growth and expansion.
>
There's a fine line between metaphysical and mystical.  The trinity you 
speak of might be less mystically described as the stages of growth and 
eventual decline that we observe with many subsystems, explainable in 
terms of economics and/or physics, often while the larger system 
ratchets its way from one metastable state to another.  I think you're 
making some good observations, but I would suggest that what appears to 
be a metaphysical trinity is actually the mundane and explainable 
behavior of some, but not all, complex systems.


> The universe has reached a point were it has created a system advanced 
> enough for creative/ complex thought and a free will beyond anything 
> else we currently know of (a stage in which the universe "computer" 
> has created AI).
>
I agree that we humans have the greatest degree of free will currently 
known, and it's important to note that our free will continues to 
increase with our increasing understanding of how our universe works.  
Greater understanding -> greater predictability -> greater freedom.


> Being the most advanced (as far as we know) system in this universe we 
> have been given the greatest power for change (by system here I mean 
> the human race). Our job (our meaning of life) is to further the 
> evolution of all we can.
>
I suspect you'll run into trouble generalizing the meaning of life for 
all us, but I think it's an admirable choice.

I'll cut my comments here, except to ask why you spell out all words 
except "you".  It's a bit distracting.

Thanks for your first post to the list!

- Jef