[extropy-chat] cheap alcohol

Eugen Leitl eugen at leitl.org
Thu Sep 22 08:57:54 UTC 2005


On Wed, Sep 21, 2005 at 08:46:05PM -1000, Robert Lindauer wrote:

> >Not clean.
> 
> really, what are the by products of which you are afraid?  Water, 
> carbon-dioxide?

Please read
http://petroleum.berkeley.edu/papers/patzek/CRPS416-Patzek-Web.pdf

I haven't done any fact-checking on it, but this looks like a reasonably
sound analysis of most relevant factors.
 
> >
> >>readily available and renewable energy resource for which we currently
> >
> >Not readily available.
> 
> In every climate except suitable for growing anything, the ability to 
> grow sugar-rich crops is abundant.

Patient: Doctor, it hurts if I do that!
Doctor: Then don't do that.

Why do you insist to ruin a perfectly good fuel option by limiting
your choices to the sweet crops, and even throw away the rest? 
 
> >
> >>have sufficient technology to continue producing it cheaply and
> >>effectively, it's not perfect.
> >
> >Not cheaply, and effectively.
> 
> In Brazil, alcohol averages about $.90/gallon.

I never said bioethanol doesn't make sense -- in Brazil.
 
> > Not only is it not perfect, it is
> >an approach only suitable for the developing countries, which
> >have no infrastructure, nor know-how in industrial chemistry.
> 
> Or perhaps in the US where many, many corporations are investing 
> heavily in ethanol production.

Are you familiar with the political process? How agribusiness
works, and how to lobby to obtain subsidies for something that
makes no sense?
 
> >It is even considerably worse than biodiesel.
> 
> In what way, in that biodiesel produces the same waste in its use as 
> regular plain ol' diesel and costs much more to produce and produces 
> harmful byproducts in its production?

I never said biodiesel was a good idea. It only looks good if you
compare it with bioethanol.

I suggest you reread the URLs I posted earlier in that thread,
and come back with more informed opinions about their comparative
merits, or rather, lack thereof.
 
> >No, I don't think you do.
> 
> I should have said "I get you."

In Communist Russia, the point gets you.

-- 
Eugen* Leitl <a href="http://leitl.org">leitl</a>
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