[extropy-chat] Cryonics and uploading

John K Clark jonkc at att.net
Mon Jan 30 15:53:45 UTC 2006

"Heartland" <velvethum at hotmail.com>

> the brain structure of the copy has absolutely no influence over whether
> original *lives* or not.

So the me of 5 minutes ago is dead, even though I remember being that person
5 minutes ago, even though the thoughts and feelings that person was having
continued uninterrupted. If that is death then death is vastly overrated,
it's a big nothing. Thoughts continue feelings continue I continue because
I do not have thoughts and feelings, I am thoughts and feelings. I am only
dead when I have a last thought.

> I, the person who typed this sentence, might be the copy of the original
> who might be dead.

In the old Twilight Zone there was a show where at the end the hero was
horrified to discover he was dead, even as a kid that never made sense to
me, here he was thinking and talking and walking around but he's upset. He
should be jumping for joy to discover death was not all it was cracked up to

> My word "perfect" means that both copy and the original share the same
> brain structure. Do you mean that in order for a copy to be "perfect"
> means that they have not only the same brain structure but also share the
> exact same experiences?

Well of course it does! The two may start out being identical but as soon as
then have different experiences they diverge, they no longer have the same
brain structure and become separate people.

> Brain is not the mind.

I am mind and mind is what the brain does, but there is always more than one
way to do something. At the present time there is only one object in the
universe that behaves in a Johnclarkian way, but that need not always be

> My strategy during the current round of debates has been to focus
> attention of readers on subjective POV of the original.

Every time I debate this people ALWAYS talk about the POV of the original.
Always. Just once try thinking about the POV of the copy, put yourself in
his place. You will find that the POV of the copy and original are

> Why should you be jealous of your perfect clone eating your chocolate in
> front of you if the clone is "technically" you?

Because he is no longer me, obviously.

   John K Clark

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