[ExI] Meta - Can a language be considered as symbiotic "living" entity on a more abstract definition of cyberphysical reality

[BillK]

On Thu, 1 Jun 2023 at 14:52, Gadersd via extropy-chat
<extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
>
> A cultural/memetic endosymbiont such as what I am proposing a moderately prescriptive language to be could be seen as an independent entity that people smarter than me would be able to clearly define the ontological boundaries of it's existance in the framework outlined in 2)
>
> If I understand you correctly, you want to extract language/culture and the reality they represent from the totality of reality so that language can be viewed as an independent entity in its own right?
>
> This is similar to what many try to achieve with machine learning. Some pattern within reality, perhaps the 3d geometry of an animal, may be encoded in some data, say an image. With machine learning one can separate the information corresponding to the location of the animal’s joints from all the other information in the image such as the lighting conditions.
>
> This can be taken much farther. If one had data corresponding to many different human languages and cultures that formed independently then one could at least in theory train a model that compresses the data into independent components. Each of the compressed parts would be uncorrelated with one another. Then the information that corresponds to language could be separated from all the other information of which it is independent. The details of language depend on biological and environment characteristics so some of this information would be included in the language entity.
>
> The technique can be used for just about anything. Reality is structured because aspects of it have correlation. By separating out the correlations into independent components one can find the distinct “entities” that make up reality.
> _______________________________________________



Not sure if it helps, but an AI seems to find a different opinion.


Question -
Can a language be considered as symbiotic "living" entity on a more
abstract definition of cyberphysical reality?

Reply -
Based on the provided context, it is possible to consider a language
as a symbiotic "living" entity in a more abstract definition of
cyberphysical reality. The Leiden Theory of the origin of language
suggests that the nature of human thought can be understood as a
process of symbiosis between a hominid host and its environment.
<https://www.researchgate.net/publication/316659539_Language_as_organism_A_brief_introduction_to_the_Leiden_theory_of_language_evolution>

This implies that language can be seen as an emergent property of the
interactions between humans and their environment, similar to how
symbiotic relationships exist in biological systems.

In the context of cyberphysical reality, language can be considered a
symbiotic entity that evolves and adapts based on its interactions
with humans and the environment. This idea is supported by the concept
of ontology development, which aims to represent the complex
relationships between various entities, including symbiotic
interactions.
<https://bmcmedinformdecismak.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s12911-020-01273-0>
By representing language as an entity that interacts with other
entities in a symbiotic manner, we can better understand its role in
shaping human thought and communication.

However, there are some limitations and challenges in applying the
concept of symbiosis to language in a cyberphysical context:

The definition of symbiosis can be vague, as it refers to the degree
and duration of physical or social contact between two organisms, with
at least one organism capable of directly producing a bodily benefit
or harm in the other. This may not directly apply to language, as it
is an abstract concept that does not necessarily involve direct
physical contact.

The concept of symbiosis is primarily used in biology and ecology, and
its applicability to language and cyberphysical reality may not be
universally accepted. It may require further exploration and
clarification to establish a more concrete connection between
symbiosis and language.

In conclusion, language can be considered a symbiotic "living" entity
in a more abstract definition of cyberphysical reality, as it evolves
and adapts based on its interactions with humans and the environment.
However, further research and clarification may be needed to establish
a more concrete connection between the concepts of symbiosis and
language in the context of cyberphysical reality.
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BillK