[ExI] "polluting my home with unwanted people"

[Dagon Gmail]

This is significant example of stupidity in action. You pose a problem here
that deceitfully suggests a clear and simple answer.
There is immigration from poor countries. This causes significant stress to
demographics and institutions in modern,
civilized countries because the immigrants are poor, undereducated and from
rather savage and backward places.
Your complaint covers poor people who resent having their children be
educated in schools that have deteriorated
because of immigration. So my questions to you are:

- is there any humane AND affordable way to stop immigration, including
people smuggling or desperate rafting?
- can immigration of undesirable poor people be reversed, again - humanely
and affordably?
- can italy do anything affordably and humanely to make sure emigrants do
not have an incentive to come and bother
poor struggling italians, or cause immigrants in italy to return or go
elsewhere?
- is there any affordable and humane tool politicians can use to make sure
backward and savage immigrants
integrate and become civilized faster, preferably somewhere later this year?

My accusation is there is no answer to any of these questions, except
"stretching up what is regarded as humane
and affordable". No politician is able to deliver on any promise of closed
borders, not without ruining your economic
infrastructure. No politician is able to deliver on a promise of sending
back immigrants humanely and affordably.
Immigrants cannot be integrated in anything less than two, three
generations.

Yes I am aware of these demographic disasters. We have problems with
backward and savage maroccans here in
the Netherlands, and many of them have gone retrograde in terms of
assimilation and integration - and yes they
behave precisely in a way as to be as contrary and unlikable as possible.
The new proverb is no longer "as stubborn
as a mule" but now has become "as stubborn as a maroccan".

However the nightmare we are in is that we are not able to offer quick
solutions. If you demand any, or claim there
are, you are effectively lying, or trying to crowbar into place "sinister or
intransparant solutions" using the savage
immigrant issue as leverage. In the mid 20th century we could wait it out -
one or two generations of assimilations
weren't all that bad an expectation. But as even the NY times is starting to
notice that sociological and technological
trends are subject to a puzzling accelerating trend, we don't have that time
anymore.

The onlyshort-ter,  solution we have is a bit roundabout - it is removing
the influence Islam has over this people.
Islam as a force in the world is currently kept on IV drip by Wahabi
sociopaths in Saudi arabia. That means - you and
everyone else who use the damn oil, is keeping islamic evangelism alive with
a hefty subsidy via state sponsored mullahs
over there. But I agree Islam is only a fraction of the problem - we need to
make societies all over the world about twice
as rich as they are now to start solving these problems. Right now by
exporting whole plainloads of economic power
abroad we are slowly strangling ourselves with our own hand. This needs to
stop, but I am not entirely sure how we
can do that. The current situation is imminently unstable.


2009/2/6 painlord2k at libero.it <painlord2k at libero.it>

> Il 04/02/2009 22.26, Damien Broderick ha scritto:
>
>> At 09:21 PM 2/4/2009 +0100, Mirco wrote:
>>
>>  >polluting my home with unwanted people
>>
>> I realize English is not your native language, but I'm not sure
>> "polluting with people" is a sentiment entirely in line with the
>> extropian or transhumanist viewpoints. But maybe I'm wrong.
>>
>
> Helping a few could be good and right, let yourself to be flooded by people
> over your ability to help them and making only your and others life
> miserable it is not good or right.
>
> Sometimes it is a need to be able to draw a limit.
> Because there is a limit to the power someone can use without destroying
> himself. And I don't think that letting themselves being destroyed is very
> extropic or transhumanist.
>
> A group of italian mothers in Rome published a letter in a newspaper today
> to announce they will move their children from the publicly funded school
> they were used to send them to others, because the school is flooded with
> alien children that have problem speaking Italian and their behaviour is not
> acceptable by civilized people. They don't want that their children pay for
> this situation.
>
> It is easy for politicos and political activist play with someone else
> lives, forcing the poors to pay the bills of their good actions. But as
> these mother wrote, the politics's children  are not the children that go to
> these schools. They go to schools in affluent places or to private schools.
> No politics will send his six years old children in a classroom where his
> child is the only native speaker.
>
> Look Obama, touting more spending in public schools, but sending his dear
> daughter to a private, elitistic and competitive school.
>
> Mirco
>
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>



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