[ExI] did sweden accidentally achieve herd immunity?

Brent Allsop brent.allsop at gmail.com
Sun Aug 16 10:51:36 UTC 2020

Thanks for this informative reply, Henrik.

On Sat, Aug 15, 2020, 12:42 PM Henrik Ohrstrom via extropy-chat <
extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:

> Hello, looking in again after a looong spring.
> Lots of leaders, news reporters and so on (and plenty of you too) think
> that Sweden didn´t shut down and quarantined.
> That is false.
> We effectively have had and still have a shut down of society and stay at
> home in parity with most countries.
> It is enforced by general good sense and not laws.
> It is still in effect, there has been no recall of societal distancing
> what so ever.
> Schools will have all kinds of security measures in place to try to avoid
> an autumn wawe of virus.
> Society is bracing for autumn when there always are viruses spreading
> after holidays and summer. won´t be fun this year
> One of many reasons for the high toll are how elderly care is
> organised which unfortunately has guaranteed virus among the elderly.
> Swedish care of old folks are an capitalistic endeavor that will probably
> make even the most rightwing hawk republicans think we are slightly
> extreme..... Anyway killing oldies by capitalism is not likely to change
> despite this shit.
> The hit on society by the virus is not due to too little shutdown. Malls,
> shopping centers and hotels are as dead here as everywhere else. flying is
> down and planes rusting, railway travel is difficult due to lack of trains
> in traffic. Web Cameras are still a scarce resource. working from home is
> the new black. I have visited my old folks once since february. nursing
> homes are still locked down, no visits.
> So we didn't do nothing, right?
> However since there will be a new fever among children as a complement to
> all the other killers like measles mumps CMV parvo chickenpox and plenty
> more of killer viri and that one is corona in one form or another since the
> children does not get as sick or more problems from this one than many
> other viri.
> So, forget getting rid of this shit. It won't go away. Ever.
> Herd immunity is years away, the 1918 flu kept killing people for more
> than 2 years.
> And that is what the swedish plan is, to be able to continue with a
> working lockdown without bankruptcy for more than 2 years.
> Working vaccines might shorten this but no one here is relying on that yet.
> And no future is corona free.
> And the antivaxxers are thriving already, a pox on on them.
> /henrik
> Den lör 15 aug. 2020 kl 02:28 skrev John Clark via extropy-chat <
> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org>:
>> It's unlikely Sweden has achieved herd immunity, The most recent studies
>> indicate only 20% of people in Stockholm have been exposed to the virus,
>> that's about the same number as those in New York and London, and most
>> think you need at least 70% to achieve herd immunity. Sweden has not had
>> significantly less economic pain than other countries, it's GDP declined by
>> 8.6% and yes that's less than the average for the European Union as a whole
>> which declined by 11.9% but it wasn't as good as some other European
>> countries which did impose strict lockdowns and had far fewer deaths, the
>> Czech Republic's GDP declined by 8.4% and Lithuania by only 5.1%.
>> And Sweden suffered more non-economic biological pain from the virus than
>> most, they had 8,200 cases of COVID-19 per million people, Norway had
>> 1,780, Denmark had 2,560, the UK had 4,600, and the US had 15,400. As
>> for deaths per 100,000 people, Sweden had 57, Norway had 5, Denmark had 11,
>> the UK had 70, and the US had 50. But of course this pandemic is far
>> from over so it will be sometime before we know what the final butcher's
>> bill is.
>> John K Clark
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