[ExI] owwwww, dang

[Dan TheBookMan]

On Sat, Oct 31, 2020 at 3:00 PM spike jones via extropy-chat
<extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
> From: John Clark <johnkclark at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [ExI] owwwww, dang
> On Fri, Oct 30, 2020 at 8:54 PM spike jones via extropy-chat <extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
>
> > Oh this is grim.  Sigh
>
> Yes, we very clearly haven't "rounded the corner", so why does Trump's
> repeated lying about something this important not bother you?
>
> John K Clark
>
> Because I don’t view a US president as a doctor or in control of world
> governments.  I don’t blame whoever is the prime minister of France
> for their current catastrophe.  I don’t care what politicians say or do
> regarding viruses: they aren’t in charge of that.

I think one can blame Trump for knowing about the likelihood -- he was
warned -- of a pandemic back in December and then basically ignoring
it and then even downplaying it for months after it became obvious
COVID-19 was serious. This isn't about what legal powers he had. It's
about what he did as a person with a global audience, including
millions who seem to fawn over him. He used that influence not to warn
people or at least prepare them for the likelihood of something big,
but to mock those who were trying to do something and then to lay any
blame elsewhere.

One can also blame him and his minions for negligently spreading the
virus at the Rose Garden and other events. This was at a point where
it should've been common knowledge that such events would be risky.

If you have a hard time grasping that -- or if you're going to pretend
you have a hard time grasping it -- imagine Trump were a news
anchorman on a news channel you don't like. Let's say CNN -- since
you've said you get mainstream political news from it and then seemed
to deny getting it from there. And let's say the virus is Ebola and
this is right before the Ebola outbreak. So there's this anchorman
Trump on a news channel you hate and for some reason people listen to
him. And he knows they listen to him. They trust him. So, he tells
them, appearing to be honest, that Ebola isn't deadly or a risk at
all. And he encourages people to travel to Ebola hot zones. And
further he tells them if they get sick with Ebola, they should chew
licorice. And many people take his advice, travel to hot zones, get
sick, chew licorice, and die, including teenagers and younger children
who adored Trump. Tens of thousands more than actually died during the
outbreak.

Still with me? Now, how would you feel about anchorman Trump? Would
you say he did absolutely nothing wrong? He was blameless? Or does he
share some blame for spreading falsehoods?

> The only political leader I really blame (a lot) is President Xi, who made
> the political decision to cover up the new virus, which caused it to get
> loose.  Not one single other political leader at any level, not one US
> state, not one US county, not one nation anywhere including the
> isolated and sparsely populated island of New Zealand was able to
> stop this virus, none.

Taiwan seems to have done well. Aside from that, one can blame Xi and
blame Trump. Again, ignoring the problem, then downplaying it, and
finally

> Politicians are not our salvation.  They are not able to stop this virus
> because viruses pay no attention to law.  In the US, there is no legal
> top-down leadership structure available to stop a contagion.  The
> federal government can close down air traffic to some extent, but
> that doesn’t help really once the virus is already here.  The US has
> functionally open borders anyway, legal or otherwise.  There is no
>closing borders to viruses.  We can damage economies trying if you
> wish, but your state has shown that lockdowns don’t really help.  You
> do realize John that your own state demonstrated that lockdowns
> don’t really help, ja?

I'm for really open borders, but 2019-nCoV spreads through close
contact or contact with droplets. It doesn't swoop through the air
over long distances, AFAIK. In effect, the main vector for global
spread has been humans. (Maybe dogs and cats are involved too.) So, if
people with it don't come into contact -- even indirect contact via
infected countertops or cough droplets -- with people who aren't
infected, the latter aren't going to get it, right? (Of course, the
big problem is asymptomatic people spreading it. That's tougher,
though minimizing contact between people intuitively would seem to
solve that, no?)

> Governments cannot help here.  The US government has no legal
> authority to do the kinds of things some other countries did (which
> didn’t work anyway.)  It cannot be done legally here, not even a
> nation-wide mask mandate.  There is no legal means whereby an
> executive order or anything the federal government demands (other
> than taxes) would be applicable to the individual citizen.  Government
> is not your salvation or mine.  You are your salvation.  I am
> my salvation.  Personal responsibility is the way.

Legality is more of an issue for legal eagles and also for the courts
to decide. (In other words, what's legal is whatever those in power
say is legal -- added that enough of the rest of people acquiesce. And
acquiesce is the norm. For instance, look at the awe many hold the
Supreme Court in. Or the Constitution. That awe is a measure of how
low they'll bow and how often their knees will touch the ground before
they'll rebel.)

Regards,

Dan
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http://author.to/DanUst