[ExI] US ?failed miserably? in wargame reportedly against China attack on Taiwan

[John Grigg]

The intelligence agencies would have to uncover a definite smoking gun
before revenge was sought.

On Mon, Aug 9, 2021 at 1:02 AM Adrian Tymes via extropy-chat <
extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:

> Still enough to potentially cause US nukes not to fly back in retaliation,
> for fear of hitting an innocent country.
>
> On Mon, Aug 9, 2021 at 12:01 AM John Grigg via extropy-chat <
> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
>
>> The only hostile nations with the ability to attack America that way are
>> Russia, China, Iran (sooner rather than later) and North Korea. A very
>> short list...
>>
>> On Sun, Aug 8, 2021 at 11:47 PM Adrian Tymes via extropy-chat <
>> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
>>
>>> No, it'd be obvious it wasn't terrorists.  This is way beyond what
>>> terrorists can muster.  Only China has motivation and capability to nuke
>>> Taiwan...but China isn't the only one able and willing (if they think they
>>> can get away with it) to nuke the US.
>>>
>>> On Sun, Aug 8, 2021 at 11:32 PM John Grigg via extropy-chat <
>>> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>> And so the CCP does this "secretly" to Taiwan and then says to them,
>>>> "oh, my gosh!" "What a horrible act of terrorism some unknown villains did
>>>> to you!" "Well, due to our huge concern for you, we will immediately send
>>>> 250,000 members of our armed services with lots of equipment to help you
>>>> rebuild!" LOL
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, Aug 8, 2021 at 11:23 PM Adrian Tymes via extropy-chat <
>>>> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> "Defeatist" might be elaborating on the possibility of nuclear
>>>>> torpedoes, launched deniably underwater, coming within a kilometer or so of
>>>>> the shore, popping up, and nuking whatever near-shore city there is.  Note
>>>>> that around half of America's biggest cities are near or on an oceanic
>>>>> coast.  As they only show up on sensors (sonar at first) well after being
>>>>> fired, there's no proof of who to retaliate against, removing the biggest
>>>>> practical obstacle to a major power using them.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sun, Aug 8, 2021 at 10:26 PM John Grigg via extropy-chat <
>>>>> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Oh, and don't forget about the Russian super-cavitation torpedoes!
>>>>>> Lol But what about drone swarms around warships, to keep them safe above
>>>>>> and below the water? And my understanding is that far more powerful lasers
>>>>>> will be deployed on our ships within the next few years. And there are the
>>>>>> vulcan guns to shoot a million big bullets at incoming missiles. But of
>>>>>> course their targeting systems have to be up to the task. And I would like
>>>>>> to think the military has some awesome above top secret weapons systems
>>>>>> that are in storage and ready to go, if war comes.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Spike, I feel like you are being defeatist, but then you are an
>>>>>> experienced engineer so perhaps you have knowledge the rest of us don't. I
>>>>>> personally think you don't fully grok how if the CCP is appeased and gets
>>>>>> their way, that American hegemony will be seen by the world as coming to an
>>>>>> end and things will never be the same. Our allies will realize that when
>>>>>> push comes to shove, and then war, that we give in to China. Jinping will
>>>>>> play his hand by telling an American president who wants to oppose a CCP
>>>>>> invasion of Taiwan, that he is risking the destruction of the global
>>>>>> economy and even the world, should things escalate to the use of nuclear
>>>>>> weapons. America must not give in to a tyrant who thinks he can get away
>>>>>> with such behavior, despite the possible risks.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> John
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sun, Aug 8, 2021 at 9:40 PM spike jones via extropy-chat <
>>>>>> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>> From: extropy-chat <extropy-chat-bounces at lists.extropy.org> On
>>>>>>> Behalf Of
>>>>>>> Stuart LaForge via extropy-chat
>>>>>>> ...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> >...I feel that losing the Taiwan scenario in a war game is just the
>>>>>>> wake up
>>>>>>> call that the U.S. naval commanders needed to keep them from
>>>>>>> fighting the
>>>>>>> previous war. The fact that the U.S. lost the war game might mean
>>>>>>> they have
>>>>>>> not figured this out yet. But the fact that the outcome of the war
>>>>>>> game
>>>>>>> leaked may mean that they have....
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Stuart LaForge
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Stuart, torpedo technology has far outpaced anti-missile technology.
>>>>>>> Torpedoes fly above the water at speeds higher than shipborne lasers
>>>>>>> can
>>>>>>> defend.  Result: flattops (and all other surface ships) cannot be
>>>>>>> defended.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> We have had Taiwan money flowing into the states for a long time
>>>>>>> now.  What
>>>>>>> I read in this leak is that the US is signaling to the money
>>>>>>> remaining in
>>>>>>> Taiwan to get out now: the USA will not defend because it cannot.
>>>>>>> But the
>>>>>>> USA will cheerfully accept rich people from Taiwan to come here to
>>>>>>> live in
>>>>>>> peace.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> spike
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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