[ExI] libertarian city - from Quora
atymes at gmail.com
Wed Aug 11 22:25:59 UTC 2021
On Wed, Aug 11, 2021 at 3:19 PM Stathis Papaioannou via extropy-chat <
extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
> On Thu, 12 Aug 2021 at 07:57, Adrian Tymes via extropy-chat <
> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
>> On Wed, Aug 11, 2021 at 2:33 PM Stathis Papaioannou via extropy-chat <
>> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
>>> Under anarchism the people run the services themselves rather than have
>>> them imposed from above.
>> How is that even possible? Unless literally everyone is involved in all
>> the services, which is impossible even for a few dozen people, the services
>> will by definition be "imposed" on anyone not running them, if they are to
>> work at all.
>> Firefighting: if your house is next to mine and on fire, then my house is
>> at danger of catching fire. If I'm a firefighter and you're not, then I
>> "impose" my service on you to save my house. (Or I don't, and let your
>> house burn to the ground, thus rendering the firefighting service
>> Roads: if I build a road from my house to town, it goes by your house,
>> and you are not otherwise involved, I have "imposed" my road upon you.
>> Health: pandemics don't care if you've opted in or not. If you're
>> infected and you're my neighbor, you need to be treated before I get sick -
>> and vice versa.
>> Police: if you have opted not to subscribe to the protection of the law,
>> people are free to impose force upon you, and will do so (if they think the
>> police really won't protect you) regardless of your alleged rights. It
>> doesn't matter how many guns you have.
> The idea is that collectives run things rather than those specially
> endowed with capital or power. Those who don’t want to participate or
> follow the rules are excluded from society. The point is that anarchism
> does not mean disorder, it means an elimination of hierarchical power
> structures. But maybe it doesn’t work and hierarchies run things better.
It doesn't work at all. All four of those examples are cases where you can
not have both functioning institutions/infrastructure and the presence of
anyone who is excluded from society. In each case, you would have to
physically remove the excluded person (and thus apply force without their
consent) or kill them (and thus apply force without their consent) in order
for those who opted into the institution/infrastructure to be able to use
them. In other words, the mere presence of one who has opted out is
essentially an application of force against those who opted in.
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