[ExI] Qualia are not in the matrix (was Re: The Matrix: Resurrections trailer)

Stathis Papaioannou stathisp at gmail.com
Sun Sep 12 01:22:16 UTC 2021

On Sun, 12 Sept 2021 at 10:57, Brent Allsop via extropy-chat <
extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:

> We do know that our redness and greenness, out of which our
> consciousness is composed, is not in the matrix.  Qualia are intrinsic
> qualities of something in all those brains, in all those vats, in the
> basement level physical reality.  They are not in the matrix.
> We'll I guess that IS a falsifiable claim, right Stathis?  The
> functionalists predicting that redness and greenness can arise (magically?)
> from anything "functioning" correctly.
> But until that is demonstrated (redness magically arising from some
> function, and we know which function!  SQRT?), I'm staying with assuming my
> qualia are intrinsic qualities of a basement level physical reality.

Can you explain how it would be less "magic" if qualia arose from a
substance than from a function? It at least makes some sort of sense that
if you are engaged in the process of looking at something you would have
qualia associated with vision rather than some other activity, and that the
qualia would not occur unless the appropriate process was occurring. On the
other hand, if qualia were associated with a substance they would be lying
there in the substance perhaps for billions of years before any conscious
beings existed.

Also, I haven't understood how you would falsify the idea that qualia are
specific to a substance. If we replaced a part of a person's brain with a
functionally equivalent component they would (by definition) say that they
were experiencing exactly the same qualia, and then what would you conclude?

> But, yes, I love the matrix movie and how it plays with the brain in a
> vat, not YET falsified, theoretical possibility.  And we constantly refer
> to searching for "THE ONE" theory of consciousness which will remain
> standing, after all others have been falsified in our Video
> <https://canonizer.com/videos/consciousness/>.  People interested in this
> topic may be interested in the "Implications for the simulation hypothesis
> <https://canonizer.com/videos/consciousness/?chapter=simulation_hypothesis>"
> chapter.
> And in the new "Computational Binding" chapter, we are about to put
> online, we borrow lots of scenes from the original matrix.  Oh, and we
> learn that the spoon, that little kid is bending with his mind, only seems
> to be chrome in color.  It is just our knowledge of the spoon or part of
> "ourselves" in our brain, that has that chrome color and is bending.  We
> learn that the actual spoon, the one out there, not part of us... it's real
> intrinsic color, is redness! ;)  (At least redness being still a not yet
> falsified hypothetical possibility, like all the other crazy but still yet
> to be falsified theories, waiting for us to discover which of all our
> descriptions of stuff in the world, is a description of redness ;)
> On Sat, Sep 11, 2021 at 11:50 AM Adrian Tymes via extropy-chat <
> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
>> So how do we know that that black sky/human batteries Earth isn't just
>> another level of the Matrix?
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Stathis Papaioannou
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