[ExI] Just a simple question

[Darin Sunley]

There's a combination of concepts I wasn't expecting to encounter this
morning: the capacity, not /merely/ to perform human uploads at all, but to
perform them with verve, gusto, and soul.

On Mon, Dec 18, 2023 at 7:46 AM William Flynn Wallace via extropy-chat <
extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:

> There was a violinist named Eugene Fodor.  His technique was astounding.
> He could play anything at any speed you wanted.  But he had no soul.  He
> played Paganini's works at his concerts because they were difficult and
> impressive.  He was just mechanical.
>
> He could play anything but not anything well.  He got addicted to cocaine
> and eventually suicided.  He knew what he was, and what he wasn't.
> Expert?  No one would have claimed that he was a great violinist.  I asked
> a world class violinist if what he lacked could be taught.  She said, in
> essence, no way.  You have a soul for music or you don't.    bill w
>
> On Sun, Dec 17, 2023 at 9:52 PM Mike Dougherty via extropy-chat <
> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
>
>> On Sun, Dec 17, 2023, 11:52 AM Adrian Tymes via extropy-chat <
>> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> To be fair: fusion has been accomplished (just not commercially viable
>>> yet), there are ways to mitigate cancer in at least some cases, and ants
>>> are kept out of many kitchens.
>>>
>>
>> "To be fair"
>>
>> So the fusion that has been accomplished makes which person the expert?
>> The one who planned the device? The one who machined it to five-nines
>> precision? The project manager who coordinated everyone else? Surely the
>> one signing the check is the expert.  Oh, I'm being facetious.  Of course I
>> am.
>>
>> Maybe our definition of "expert" differ between "someone who has done a
>> thing" and "someone who knows how a thing is done."  Was Neil Armstrong the
>> only expert to walk on the moon before Aldrin also did the thing?  I am of
>> a mind to grant many other NASA folk the title of 'expert' on lunar landing
>> despite the fact they have never done so.  There must be a few people who
>> were on duty at mission control for more than one lunar landing project
>> implementation - would that make them double-expert compared to Armstrong
>> or Aldrin?  I know, the geniuses on this list will tell me how wrong I am
>> because the type (you know there's a type) are so smart they don't need to
>> listen.  I profess to be neither smart nor correct.
>>
>>  My point was not to claim there are no experts in the endeavor to keep
>> ants out of the kitchen.  That was an absurd rhetorical device.  It might
>> have made a reader laugh if he or she were familiar with the pattern of
>> casual conversation.  I sometimes marvel at the voluminous prose expounded
>> on this list, but it's rarely in a voice that I prefer to consume.  It may
>> be the same with what and how I write. Hmm.
>>
>> Anyway, i guess we can have no experts in mind uploading until someone
>> has been uploaded and their post-biological identity demands legal
>> protection of selfhood with respect to autonomy and reasonable safety from
>> the computing hardware being switched off.  Uploaded mice running robot
>> bodies through mazes they trained on as mere flesh... not good enough to
>> call the any of those scientists "expert"
>>
>> Is there any other field that we might agree has "experts" in a domain of
>> knowledge despite themselves having not achieved the ultimate example of
>> their profession/craft/art/etc?
>>
>> Ex: any pianist who flawlessy performs every note of the Minute Waltz in
>> under sixty seconds can claim the "expert" title.  The one who knows how to
>> shave three seconds from their personal best of 1m2s is just a
>> wannabe/poseur.
>>
>> PS. I know the Minute Waltz isn't intended to be played in 60 seconds.
>> Hyperbole is usually meant to amuse. :)
>>
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