[extropy-chat] No Joy in Mudville

[Adrian Tymes]

--- Kevin Freels <cmcmortgage at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> I wouldn;t even call it a civil union.

Technically, I think that Brian Lee was referring to
me suggestion, which definitely was for "civil
unions".

Perhaps you meant to say, "I would go further than
civil unions"?  ;)

> When it comes to property, it becomes a matter of
> contract law.

And a government-recognized special form of contract
which can affect things like taxes.  (It shouldn't,
but better that we use "civil unions" than "marriage".
Getting government out of social engineering is
another debate entirely - no need to make those who
want social engineering oppose the measure to only
officially recognize civil unions, especially since
some who might get all emotional about not recognizing
marriage would, in a debate over civil unions, come
to agree that this form of social engineering should
end.)

> If you want
> someone to have a right to your property, you draw
> it up in a contract. If
> you want to will something, you make a will.

Are you going to require everyone to do this?

> Right now, my
> girlfriend (happily
> co-habitating for four years) has no say over what
> happens to me when I die.
> She knows I plan to go to Alcor. My parents are both
> Catholic and would
> resist this. Since I am not married, my parents
> would be making the
> decisions. My only option at this moment to give my
> girlfriend control over
> this is to marry her, which is against my
> (non)"religion". EVen if I go to
> the JP to get married instead of a church, they
> still invoke God.
> Doing away with marriage...and civil unions would
> force everyone to make
> those arrangements in contracts.

Don't most cities or counties offer to issue
marriage certificates to individuals who don't go
through officially recognized churches?  For instance,
it is traditional that the captain of a ship has the
power to marry, and you can probably find one willing
to do so with no reference to the supernatural.  Yet
any captains who do this (save for cruise ship
captains) are unlikely to file paperwork with
authorities already familiar with the ones performing
the ceremony.  But a couple who planned to do this
could go to city hall and ask for the necessary
documents, to be filed upon return.

There are other examples, but this may be the best if
the government officials you deal with demand some
sort of traditional authority, since the existance of
ship captains is far older than Christianity.  Then
again, almost any judge could also claim the power to
marry - again, without need of reference to the
supernatural - based on similarly ancient tradition.