[ExI] what the hell was i thinking?

[Dan TheBookMan]

On Mar 14, 2019, at 10:29 AM, William Flynn Wallace <foozler83 at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> That view of libertarianism is diametrically opposed to libertarianism. Libertarianism, in terms of authority, is the view that no one should have authority over anyone else.  dan
> 
> Just where do these 'true' libertarians live?  I don't know of a place where no one has any authority over anyone else.  bill w

You’re confusing a view (libertarianism)?with whether it’s been totally put into practice (a fully libertarian community). If you want to make the argument that since no one lives that way, it’s impossible or at least wildly improbable, then that’s another discussion. (Of course, to me, it would be like you arguing in 1800 that there’s no society where men don’t rule women. Ergo, anyone calling for women to not be ruled by men is a whacky utopian.)   

Regards,

Dan
   Sample my Kindle books at:
http://author.to/DanUst

>> On Thu, Mar 14, 2019 at 12:12 PM <spike at rainier66.com> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: extropy-chat <extropy-chat-bounces at lists.extropy.org> On Behalf Of Dan TheBookMan
>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2019 9:41 AM
>> To: ExI chat list <extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org>
>> Subject: Re: [ExI] what the hell was i thinking?
>> 
>> On Mar 14, 2019, at 9:15 AM, <spike at rainier66.com> <spike at rainier66.com> wrote:
>> > This is, in my view, the message of libertarianism: support authority but watch them closely. 
>> 
>> That view of libertarianism is diametrically opposed to libertarianism. Libertarianism, in terms of authority, is the view that no one should have authority over anyone else. (In the case of the police, abolition seems the appropriate libertarian response. Self-identified libertarians who scoff at this are almost certainly not libertarians but simply conservatives posing as libertarians.) And the best defense against the excesses and abuses of any authority is simply not to ever grant authority (over oneself and over others) in the first place. Failing that — because most folks don’t want to take such a bold stance — one shouldn’t be so naive as to believe that various authority-approved watchdog measures will somehow work well to curb arbitrary power.   
>> 
>> Regards,
>> 
>> Dan
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Dan, your comment demonstrates that the Libertarian party is no more unified, and probably less so, than the two American mainstream parties (which are both so dis-unified no one can really tell what they stand for (do you know? (neither do we.)))  
>> 
>> Within the Libertarian party are those who hold the view that no one should have authority and those who recognize that any no-authority society is at the mercy of the bad guys.  A pragmatic approach to the question results in the lower case l libertarian, often conflated with lower case c conservative, but distinct in my view.
>> 
>> A pragmatic approach recognizes the firm necessity of authority, but also recognizes that power corrupts.  So... power must be very strictly controlled.
>> 
>> We are now seeing a technologically-fueled vast and rapid expansion of surveillance.  We are getting to where home-mounted video is common enough that it is a highly effective tool against any crime which requires the bad guy to physically visit the home of the victim.  Enough citizens have cameras and have offered access to the constables that the bad guy can be tracked right to wherever he went.  The constables aren't publicizing it, but we see the results.  Package theft, so common just five years ago, has taken a nosedive in this area.  The UPS trucks and FedEx trucks seldom have signature-required deliveries anymore.  It is safe enough to leave the packages on the doorstep.  I now buy nearly everything from online retailers and have never had a package stolen.  If it ever happens, I will have good video evidence on the perp from two different angles.
>> 
>> spike
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