[ExI] GPT-4 on the Incommunicability of Qulia

[Brent Allsop]

On Sat, Mar 25, 2023 at 7:42 AM Dave S via extropy-chat <
extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:

> On Saturday, March 25th, 2023 at 9:18 AM, Brent Allsop via extropy-chat <
> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
>
> > Instead of using the word 'qualia' which has so many religious
> connotations like "spiritual qualiat"?
> > Can we just instead focus on what is a physical "quality"?
>
> Is that the same as a physical property? If not, what's the difference?
>

Yes, qualities are one type of physical property.



> > The only reason qualities are "incommunicable" has to do with the
> difference between a code for redness, and redness, itself.
>
> I think their incommunicability is fundamental. You can't describe a
> physical property that someone has never experienced in terms of properties
> they have experienced.
>
> > A "code" for redness, is something that is not redness, representing
> redness. Physical greenness, physical +5 volts, a physical pit on a paper,
> or an abstract world like 'red' can code for redness.
>
> What does "physical green can code for redness" mean?
>

You are using quality blind terminology here.  Do you mind if we change our
definitions to be adequate to talk about this stuff, as the 45 supporters
of RQT
<https://canonizer.com/topic/88-Theories-of-Consciousness/6-Representational-Qualia>
 do?

Perception of things is done at a distance via chains of causal intrinsic
properties. There are at least the following two sets of intrinsic
properties which must be considered if one is not qualia blind:


   1. “red” The intrinsic physical property of objects that are the target
   of our observation, the initial cause of the perception process (i.e. when
   the strawberry reflects 650 nm (red) light). A label for Anything that
   reflects or emits ‘red’ light.
   2. “redNESS” The different intrinsic physical property of our knowledge
   of red things, the final result of our perception of red.


In other words, from the context, when you used the term 'green', you
really meant greenness, right?  If you use one word 'green' to represent
both of these physical properties, you can't know which physical property
you are talking about.



> > But, since they are not redness, you need a dictionary to get from the
> thing that is not redness, back to the redness, itself.
>
> The brain maps sensory inputs into their corresponding properties.
>
> -Dave
>
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