[ExI] Do you have a secret family pass phrase?

Brent Allsop brent.allsop at gmail.com
Mon Jan 20 20:01:56 UTC 2025 

Yes, Utah seems to be the Multi Level Marketing capital of the world.



On Mon, Jan 20, 2025 at 11:42 AM Keith Henson via extropy-chat <
extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:

> My experiences with the scientology cult make me think there is a big
> genetic component to being sucked into a cult.
>
> I don't have survey data but my impression is that people with Mormon
> genetic background are considerably overrepresented.
>
> The scientologists also get sucked into every MLM scheme that comes along.
>
> Best wishes,
>
> Keith
>
> On Mon, Jan 20, 2025 at 9:58 AM efc--- via extropy-chat
> <extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
> >
> > Thank you very much for sharing. I can't say I have contributed much to
> > the "positive" side. I remember that we tend to dive into what you can
> > know, how you know it, what it might imply etc.
> >
> > As long as you feel you are in a better place, I'm happy for you! I'm
> also
> > happy hearing about your experience because it restores hope for me, that
> > change can be achieved by people talking with each other.
> >
> > It might not happen fast, it might not happen at all, but for some it
> does
> > happen. This is very inspirational.
> >
> > On Mon, 20 Jan 2025, Brent Allsop via extropy-chat wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > I resemble that "seeds of doubt" comment.  I met some brilliant
> philosophers in Japan on my mission, who were willing to talk to us
> > > in business suits.  It made me realize their teachings, in many ways,
> were far better than what I was pushing.  By the end of my
> > > mission my "testimony" in a lot of what I was teaching was gone.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Mon, Jan 20, 2025 at 9:32 AM efc--- via extropy-chat <
> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > >       On Mon, 20 Jan 2025, Kelly Anderson via extropy-chat wrote:
> > >
> > >       > As a former missionary, I can tell you that you do have a
> point here.
> > >       > Although there were a few agnostics in my mission who were
> there just
> > >       > because of social pressure. It almost worked on me, I lasted
> until I
> > >       > was 45 as an active Mormon. Eventually, life just hit me over
> the head
> > >       > with a 4x4 and I figured things out.
> > >       >
> > >       > But... on my mission, converts were definitely what we were
> going for.
> > >       > I myself converted around 72 people. I am not especially proud
> of
> > >
> > >       I enjoy talking to the very polite, business suit clad guys when
> I
> > >       meet them. Sadly, after we get into to deep philosophical
> waters, they
> > >       lose interest and move on. ;) I often wonder if I managed to sow
> some
> > >       seeds of doubt in them during our conversations. =)
> > >
> > >       > that, and I'm sure there aren't 10% of them that are still
> active. But
> > >       > I am not ashamed of it either, because I was just as much a
> victim of
> > >       > the brainwashing as they were. Not believing in free will now
> gives me
> > >       > a pretty solid "out" for what I did. And, I actually feel good
> about
> > >       > the one Jehovah's Witness that I converted. Mormonism is
> definitely
> > >       > better than that craziness. Kids who die from not being given
> the
> > >       > choice to have blood transfusions because of their parents are
> > >       > considered martyrs. That's really messed up. Baptism for the
> dead
> > >       > doesn't hurt anyone, by comparison.
> > >       >
> > >       > -Kelly
> > >       >
> > >       > On Sun, Dec 29, 2024 at 10:21 AM Darin Sunley via extropy-chat
> > >       > <extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
> > >       >>
> > >       >> The LDS missionary program is only secondarily about
> recruiting new members from the general population. Really, the
> > >       people running the program don't care if the nice young people
> in the shirts and ties and nametags ever convince anyone
> > >       of anything.
> > >       >>
> > >       >> The program is designed from the ground up to cement the
> lifelong emotional loyalty of the missionaries themselves,
> > >       who are barely trained children spending two years living away
> from home in a commune under a complete media blackout.
> > >       >>
> > >       >> The carrot is that, after they finish their stint as a
> missionary (which they themselves paid tens of thousands of
> > >       dollars for the privilege), they are on a track that, if they
> pursue it, can take them into senior leadership positions
> > >       within the church..
> > >       >>
> > >       >> They are barely equipped to even present the elevator pitch
> for their own theology, much less grapple critically with
> > >       anyone else's, because That Is Not The Point.
> > >       >>
> > >       >> On Sun, Dec 29, 2024 at 10:11 AM Ben Zaiboc via extropy-chat <
> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
> > >       >>>
> > >       >>> On 27/12/2024 14:45, efc at disroot.org wrote:
> > >       >>> > The mormons often seem more afraid of me, than I of them,
> when we
> > >       >>> > start to discuss philosophy and they soon tire of the
> conversation. ��
> > >       >>>
> > >       >>> I've had a similar experience with Jehovah's Witnesses. It's
> odd that
> > >       >>> the god squad seem most reluctant to talk to people who seem
> to actually
> > >       >>> know something about religion! It's like mathematicians
> being leery of
> > >       >>> anyone who shows any knowledge of maths.
> > >       >>>
> > >       >>> This may be my cynicism showing, but I suspect that it's
> because they
> > >       >>> are more interested in compliance with their particular
> viewpoint than
> > >       >>> understanding. If you want to understand things, you're
> obviously not
> > >       >>> good convert material!
> > >       >>>
> > >       >>> I think it was Luther who said that reason is the enemy of
> faith. Seems
> > >       >>> he was right.
> > >       >>>
> > >       >>> --
> > >       >>> Ben
> > >       >>>
> > >       >>> _______________________________________________
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